This season, diehard VGK fan and legendary combat sports columnist Kevin Iole will be delivering columns a few times a month on Sundays. Kevin’s back today to take a look at a position of depth, one that’s been notoriously thin in years past.
There is no more important player to the Golden Knights’ chances of capturing the Stanley Cup in a few months — not Jack Eichel, not Mark Stone, not Alex Pietrangelo — than Robin Lehner.
The Knights will be a Cup favorite if Lehner plays during the playoffs the way he played on Saturday in a 3-2 shootout victory over the Tampa Bay Lightning at Amalie Arena.
Lehner was consistently excellent on Saturday and he actually out-dueled the great Andrei Vasilevskiy in the shootout.
Lehner has been one of the five best Golden Knights during the season, though to hear many fans grumble about him, they act as if he were the modern version of Roberto Romano (Look him up; it’s not pretty).
He’s not Marc-Andre Fleury, not in terms of personality, not in terms of athleticism nor in terms of lineage.
Fleury’s mistakes were often overlooked in both Las Vegas and Pittsburgh because of his mega-watt smile, his incredible humility, and his super-human athleticism.
Lehner isn’t a charismatic personality, but not a lot of hockey players are. As a group, their public personas fall somewhere between ultra-vanilla — “The guys played great in front of me” — to vomit-inducing. Have you ever listened to what Reilly Smith says during his interviews? And it doesn’t take Lieutenant Columbo to figure out that he’d rather be doing anything short of sticking needles in his eyes than appearing on an intermission interview or answering questions from the media.
Lehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated. Has he let in goals that he should have stopped? No question.
There are basically zero stand-up goalies in the NHL today, but at 6 feet 4, 255 pounds, Lehner is the one guy who could do it and be successful. He’s a smart goaltender and thinks the game well, and by playing his angles intelligently, he takes away most of that by standing up.
It’s when he gets moving that he gets into trouble. That hurt him Saturday against Tampa, when he was down and the puck went into the net off of him. It even happened in the shootout.
Lehner won the job from Fleury by merit in the bubble in 2020, Allan Walsh’s ridiculous stab-in-the-back picture notwithstanding. Lehner outplayed Fleury by a large margin and gave the Knights the kind of goaltending they needed to win the Cup. That had nothing to do with playing Lehner over Fleury and everything to do with forwards who in The Bubble suddenly couldn’t hit the ocean from the deck of the Titanic.
Lehner broke into the NHL as a teenager with the Ottawa Senators in the 2010-11 season, and has been among the league’s elite goaltenders through stints in Ottawa, Buffalo, the New York Islanders, Chicago, and Vegas.
Interestingly, his .911 save percentage with VGK is the worst of his career, behind Ottawa (.914), Buffalo (.916), Chicago (.918), and the Islanders (.930). This is despite the fact that VGK are, with the exception of the Islanders, the best defensive team he’s played with.
The same thing is true in the playoffs. His playoff save percentage with the Knights is .911. He played two games in mop-up duty with Ottawa, and was at .920. He played eight games with the Islanders in the 2018-19 season and was at .936.
It’s most likely coincidence more than anything that explains those numbers, but that Ottawa team included guys like Mark Stone, Erik Karlsson, Daniel Alfredsson, and Sergei Gonchar. The Islanders, like now, were coached by Barry Trotz. Enough said.
VGK’s hope of winning the Cup this year hinges on Lehner playing like he did when he was on the Island, when it seemed easier to pick the correct Powerball numbers than it did to put one behind him.
Unlike his first two seasons in Las Vegas, Lehner knows it’s his net and that the Knights’ Cup hopes will ride on his broad shoulders. For a sensitive, thoughtful guy that is huge. There is no specter of Fleury coming in to be cheered by an adoring crowd.
If he gives up six goals in a playoff game, book it: He’ll start the next one. And the one after that. And that one after that.
He doesn’t make goaltending look as entertaining as Fleury did — Has there ever been a greater wow moment in modern hockey than Fleury’s Superman save on Toronto? — but that’s not the job. The job is to stop pucks.
And despite what the haters say, Lehner has done that exceptionally well with the VGK. Yeah, he’s given up a bad one or three here and there, but guess what: So did Martin Brodeur, Patrick Roy, Jacques Plante, and even a guy named Fleury.
It happens.
The key is what happens next after the bad one. And for the most part this season, Lehner has stopped it. And that’s why despite an unbelievably difficult year with injury and illness, the Knights are alone in first place.
If they’re to get where everyone in VGK Nation hopes and prays they do, it’s going to be Lehner who carries them there.
**You can find all of Kevin’s tremendous boxing and MMA work at Yahoo Sports here.**
Josh
Defending Lehner? He is having a horrible season. This year, among goalies with more than 14 games, he is 25th in GAA and 30th in SV%. Those kind of numbers are not acceptable on a cup-contending team. It is also a Captain Obvious statement to say that the goalie is the most important player to a team’s Cup chances. Lehner’s numbers are actually worse than Fleury’s were in 2019-20 when Fleury’s father died mid-season and GMGM lost confidence in him…and traded for Lehner. Maybe it is time for another goalie acquisition.
Galdom
What do you suggest. Trade him for Fleury who has the same exact numbers.
ROTFL
THE hockey GOD
bull shit, he’s not having a “horrible season”. It’s pretty obvious you are one of the few targeted by
“Lehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated”
Lehner beat defending SC champs TWICE this year. GROW UP.
There are lots of unsophisticated fan in Vegas, spoiled, degenerate gamblers of worst kind. Know nothing, losers.
Josh
Guess “the hockey god” doesn’t pay attention to math. The MATH says that he is one of the worst goalies in the league this season.
Keep calling people names though. That helps your argument.
THE hockey GOD
your math , as galdom pointed out, is flawed.
the VGK are in first place.
PERIOD.
that is only “math’ that counts at this point.
Name one person I called a name ? Be specific.
Hockey Killjoy
First place in the worst division in the league is nothing to hang your hat on! We wouldn’t Even be in third place in any other division. But if can play like he did against the Lightning then his numbers might improve.
Howard
Nashville made Cup Final with Pekka Rinne, and basically Pekka was the real Conn Smythe for The Pens in 2017. So what, VGK is in first place in a piss-poor division. VGK is a good team no question, but they are not Cup contenders right now, and IMO, not even close. Regular season IS NOTHING like NHL playoffs, NOTHING.
Justin
Skillful and predictable timing of this article. Half a season of pretty bad goaltending allowing pretty much at least a soft goal every single game, followed by a few games of solid play and it’s “look I told you so he’s a great goalie!” Unfortunately data analysis doesn’t work like that, picking out only the last few days points to support your argument that are contrary to the larger number of sample data.
I’m a VGK fan so I sure hope he turns it around and continues playing solid. And I personally like RL, respect him and what he’s gone through and love his candor. But let’s not suggest he’s the goalie we hope for after a few good games in a long underperforming season. He plays well when the team decides to totally shut down the other team, swarm the goal, and not give up anything. Broissout plays well in that situation as well, and so would a lot of other mid level nhl goalies.
Galdom
Justin, I think you will get your wish and he will have a good second half. According to what he has done the rest of his career the first half really was an anomaly so it shouldn’t be shocking that he turns it around.
Galdom
Justin, I think you will get your wish and he will have a good second half. According to what he has done the rest of his career the first half really was an anomaly so it shouldn’t be shocking that he turns it around.
THE hockey GOD
VGK is in first place, bad goalies do not get their team’s in first place.
“Lehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated”
pretty much targets the RL haters.
Daryl
Not e ting on RL, but being in 1st in the Pacific is no big feat
Galdom
Thank you Kevin Iole.
Richie-Rich
Lehner has played great the past 4 games. Prior to that, between 1 Dec and the start of this road trip, Lehner’s save percentage was .872.
So, please – stop –
It’s a bit early to start heaping glorious praise on The Panda. Put together several more weeks of solid goaltending and then I might take another look at my position from mid-January. By mid-January I had given up completely on him.
I am giving him credit for 4 straight games of playing above his average.
Let’s see him maintain it.
Say what you will about MAF, but he’s the future HOFer and there simply isn’t any way to compare these two goalies in any balanced, equal or fair way. Before those type comparisons even begin, Lehner needs to win a Stanley Cup.
Period.
Galdom
There’s no reason to lie. It was never .872. It was never under .900 at any point this season. before the road trip it was .904
You may not agree with Kevin Iole but don’t just throw out fake numbers out there.
Richie-Rich
Read my comment again. I didn’t say his avg was .872, what I said was that it was .872 between Dec 1st and about 15 January.
Galdom
.886 not .872 from Dec 1 to January 23
And I’m not gonna insult your intelligence to tell you that Lehner had a good first half because he didn’t.
But brace yourself for a strong second half. The defence was horrible for him and did him no favours in the first half. That was part of it
Richie-Rich
I’m not bracing for anything Galdom. I actually hope he turns it around. His stats show he can play better than the first half, but he’s not going to average .968. He’s had four outstanding games, that’s it. His prior performance throughout his career says he cannot sustain that level.
There’s nothing to brace about. VGK defense has to play a lot better AND the offense is going to need to score an average of 4 goals or better against top level teams. That is what the statistics say.
THE hockey GOD
GAldom , RR and all other haters, e.g. bozo and his other bozo are known RL haters. They are all full of shit.
Galdom
.886 not .872
Period
Richie-Rich
yours is .886 because you are sampling a different set of games. His low was .872.
Galdom
No. Not doing a different sampling of games. I took your timeline and every single game from December 1 to January 23. His safe percentage was .886 not .872. Did it with the nhl.com website. .886 is bad as well but it’s not .872
Don B
Really .886 or .872 not much difference. Either not good. we can only hope the last four games are what is to come for the rest of the season.
THE hockey GOD
galdom he’s cherry picking to enhance his RL hate.
Anyone can cherry pick and data mine to try and make their point.
WE all know it won’t fly.
Galdom
This Lehner having to win a Stanley Cup argument is absolutely ridiculous. What the hell does Fluery’s Stanley Cup in Pittsburgh have to do with Vegas. Are you gonna tell me that Fleury is better than Igor Shesterkin who will win the Vezina this year. Because Shesterkin hasn’t won a cup.
It’s killing you guys that Lehner is playing awesome right now.
Hdbiker7851
No it’s not killing anyone they are thankful and hopeful it will continue. To argue back and forth the diff eff tence between 88.6 and 87.2 is stupid – both numbers are shit. The litmus test is what happens going forward but for KH is the reason vegas wins the Cup is plain stupid. Teams win the Cup and the last few games the entire club has done a better job. When they play 60 minutes they have a better than average chance of coming out on top otherwise its anyone’s guess. What’s amazing is those who give RL a pass for shitty performance while condemning MAF. One has zero to do with the others but it keeps going on. If Lehner can stay with it and stay on his skates he has a chance if he doesn’t and needs to move around he is toast or a fish out of water for those who don’t know the difference.
Richie-Rich
If you look at my posts, I only respond to those who continue to bring MAF into this discussion. MAF has no bearing on my analysis whatsoever, NONE>
In fact, I have said we should stop talking about MAF altogether. By mid-January, statistically, Lehner was playing like shit with an .886 save percentage (tired of arguing about what sampling of games are in the mix). That shit piss poor goaltending, period even with a crap defense in front of you. Piss poor.
Now, with that said, Lehner has had 4 straight games where he has played way over his career percentage by a LOT. You have to give Lehner credit for this road trip as well as credit the VGK defense.
However, credit Lehner even more because he played top tier NHL teams and came away with points! He looked great this week and I am not going to take anything away from that performance.
However, he’s going to have to sustain that level of play in the 2nd half of this season and even more importantly play at this level in the postseason.
Do that and I become an instant fan of RL. As of 15 January I declared the patient dead, but now RL has had a great week. I for one would love to see him continue this level of play.
And I am done talking about MAF. What a waste of time. That drum has been beaten flat.
Daryl
You notice how it’s always the MAF haters who continue to bring him up. Anyone who makes a negative comment about RL, his faithful will step in and say something about MAF. I have yet to figure out just why they must continue to do that
THE hockey GOD
no one brought up MAF on this thread , only the RL haters bring that up.
Take your spin out elsewhere, it won’t fly today.
Per author “Lehner has been one of the five best Golden Knights during the season, though to hear many fans grumble about him, they act as if he were the modern version of Roberto Romano (Look him up; it’s not pretty).”
hdbiker7851
Picjie _ relax – I didn’t say you brought MAF into anything – If you look at my posts, I only respond to those who continue to bring MAF into this discussion. MAF has no bearing on my analysis whatsoever, NONE> I only pointed out to you and whoever arguing about 88.6 versus 87.2 was stupid and means nothing – either unacceptable. We all have our feelings about the capabilities of Lehner and most are fairly set in their ways – that’s ok but for Iolo to suggest RL is the savior (ultimate key) to Vegas’ success is more nuts than worrying about the difference between 88.6 and 87.2 . I question and have stated before with zero reservation if Vegas is depending on Lehner to succeed they are in trouble. Could he be part of a Cup team sure, but his record suggests no any other team has been with believed that to be the case or they would have never let him go. This whole thing about Lehner where people want to make anyone who doesn’t agree with them concerning his performance “haters” is even more ridiculous.
THE hockey GODv
RL has beat TBL twice
PERIOD
take your RL hate elsewhere it won’t fly here.
Another one that falls into the “Lehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated” category.
It’s the end of January and RL hasn’t fallen apart, so much for your bulls hit prediction. GTH
Daryl
Don’t you know it was never his fault… When he played bad and had bad numbers, it was because the defense in front of him was bad
THE hockey GOD
i have been saying that for weeks, finally someone picks up on it
when RL becomes the farce, and every player does at some point
in their career (usually at end, even Wayne Gretski, well everyone
except the great Gordie Howe); then I will let you know.
SMH
Way to cherry-pick those stats to find a segment of time which fits your hatred of Lehner and nut-hugging of Fleury!
One way to “compare these two goalies in any balanced, equal or fair way” would be to look at their career (large sample size!) save percentages:
Regular season: Fleury = 0.913 vs. Lehner = 0.917
Playoffs: Fleury = 0.912 vs. Lehner = 0.919
And yes, Fleury has won a Stanley Cup and Lehner hasn’t. But it is just stupid to say that you can’t begin to compare players until the other has won a Cup. And please don’t forget that Fleury was the starting goalie in the finals for only 1 of those 3 Cups he won with the Penguins. For the other 2, he was BENCHED because he was sucking so bad, and Matt Murray was in goal for those Cup wins. While Penguins fans generally love Fleury as much as Knights fans, they will never forget that reality.
Sorry to bring so many facts that crush your endless trolling anti-VGK narrative in your post after post after post after post. Happy mid-January!
Period.
Richie-Rich
See my post in this thread about MAF. I am done talking about Chicago’s goalie. My focus is on the VGK goaltending, period.
SMH
The last thing that anyone on this planet needs is to see or read another post from you, so I think I’ll take a pass on that invitation…
But so glad that you are done talking about Fleury now that I have set you straight with the facts! Period.
THE hockey GOD
@SMH- you got that right !
“Lehner has been one of the five best Golden Knights during the season, though to hear many fans grumble about him, they act as if he were the modern version of Roberto Romano (Look him up; it’s not pretty).”
PERIOD
Daryl
Just like thg, thinks his opinion is the only one that matters. I wonder who’s lied to you all these years to make you think your opinion really matters that much
Galdom
SMH, I agree 1000% with you. Generally I try to take the largest sample size of stats to make my point. But nobody likes when I do that. If Lehner over his entire career has a higher save percentage than the guy who nobody wants me to mention their name anymore then how is that not significant??? Why would what Robin Lehner has done in an extremely small sample size between December 1 and January 23 carry more weight than what he has done over his entire career??? It’s really annoying. I think it’s common sense to take the largest sample size. And then when that’s not accepted I take different sample sizes like only including numbers since 2017-18 when Fleury joined the VGK. Doing that is actually advantageous to him as it makes his numbers go up. And Lehner’s still are slightly better over that timeframe. This is the nonsense that leads me to believe that people generally hate Lehner and won’t give him a fair shake. And I believe that Darryl reiterated that point that people aren’t giving him a fair shake.
Daryl
And here is my issue with just using stats and it’s a perfect example of why you can’t always look at stats. Take last year for example, RL beat just one team with a winning record. When he faced a very good team, COL, he gave up 6 goals. MAF aced almis every top tier team while RL was used for teams like SJS who were at the bottom of the division. The quality of opponent isn’t always the same
Daryl
SMH, another clueless MAF hating poster. I’ve already provided stats and details more than once on MAF time in Burgh which shows you have absolutely no idea what you are taking about. MAF wasn’t benched because he sucked. Get a clue!!!!!
SMH
Nope, you’re wrong again, which is par for the course from you. I am a big MAF fan, and own 5 of his jerseys (including 1 from his days at Cape Breton). I have friends who are major Penguins fans, and they have told me in an unbiased way (which you are incapable of) how it all went down with Fleury in Pittsburgh. However, I am now first and foremost a VGK fan, so therefore I am also now a big Lehner fan. And therefore, I will present facts & information on occasion when website trolls like you and Rich continue to attack Lehner simply because he is the primary reason (along with Fleury’s agent of course) why Fleury is no longer in Vegas. All of the other “reasons” you & your ilk give to dislike Lehner are just b.s., and I am quite certain that you cringe every time that Lehner has a good game. Us true VGK fans loved and rooted for Fleury, and now love and root for Lehner, just like we loved and rooted for Schmidt, and now love and root for Pietrangelo. Yes, I know a very hard concept for you to understand because you are incapable of leaving a post (and god knows you leave a hundred of them per day, just like ol’ Rich) without denigrating the VGK team, fans, or front office in some way. Must be horrible to be filled with so much hate & misery – too bad you can’t find another outlet for it than yelling at real VGK fans on a website every…single…day…
THE hockey GOD
whoa ! SMH big smack down there ! EPIC POST. I am saving this one.
Ignore these haters, as author says
“Lehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated”
Daryl
I’m wrong because you say I’m wrong and for no other reason. You sound exactly like thg. You have this ego that you are the only one that is right, well you and anyone who agrees with you. Everyone else’s opinion is just wrong. You prove that time and time again with your posts. You basically only sow up when RL has a good game so you can tell everyone else how wrong they are. Prime example is the Caps game where you just had to call me out before I even got online to post a comment. That showed just how weak you resy are.
As for MAF and his time in Burgh, if you really are as big of fan as you say you are why would you have to ask others??? It’s also shows how full of shit you are. MAF was injured and his backup played amazing. MAF came back from injury and still played well but he was out played by the backup. Pens went with the hot goalie, they didn’t sit MAF b/c he was playing bad.
You can go troll someone else now, maybe find someone who doesn’t actually know anything about hockey so you don’t look so stupid, just like thg
Daryl
Thg,
You are so cluecluess. Yeah, big smackdoen. What a cliwn
Henderson One
Other than the goalie, my concern is the throat problem that Patches and Stone have during the playoffs. You have to score to win. They don’t or at least haven’t.
Galdom
I agree Henderson owl. The goal scoring was atrocious this road trip. Lennar stole four points.
THE hockey GOD
@ galdom “I agree Henderson owl. The goal scoring was atrocious this road trip. Lennar stole four points.” part one The haters said RL was going to out , done, done, done, fried by January. Did not happen. Part two the VGK haters said VGK needed score four or more goals a game to win. Did not happen.
A lot of smoke and hot air around these parts.
Daryl
If VGK had a viable backup there is no telling what might of happened with his sub. 900%. Add to it this FO nor coach will ever admit they made a mistake. If Broisset had played lights out every game he’s played and as bad as RL was during the first half of the season, he might have been out
THE hockey GOD
spot on , henderson one
zero shots in third period of key road trip game, says it all.
TikiOwl
VGK got to the playoffs in spite of Lehner missing multiple games during the regular season. Fleury wound up playing 36 regular season games with a save percentage of 0.928 and 6 shutouts while Lehner played 19 with a 0.919 percentage and 1 shutout. Minutes played 2147 vs 1155 so you might wonder where the Knights would have been without Fleury. Yes Lehner played well in the bubble but VGK made the playoffs thanks to Fleury in large part.
Galdom
Lehner was .919 with a shutout last year. That’s pretty damn good. Thanks for mentioning that tiki owl. Not as good as Fluery Vezina winning season last year but pretty damn good
Daryl
Let’s not forget that RL beat just 1 team last year with an overall winning record
Galdom
That is true. I don’t think anybody’s disputing that Lehner was the better performer in 2019-20 and Fluery was better in 2020-21.
THE hockey GOD
nice TO
only reason the “farce” won Vezina was because RL spelled the old goalie and his failing knees. If Billy Buckner , and his sick agent, had played more games he would never have made it to the end. Sure the farce had a “flair’ for over the top dramatic saves. That is not RL style, his size only intimidates shooter to miss. Look at how many times the TBL star shooter missed the net close in in yesterdays’ game. That is one aspect of RL game that RL haters never mention.
Daryl
So, MAF owes RL for winning that award??? That is good to know smh
THE hockey GOD
MAF even said as much
Daryl
Sure he did…. He must have said that on one of those Canadian reports
Daryl
And for someone who is so selfish and only thinks about himself, why would he ever give RL any credit for anything?
Eric
My thought was he was still having issues after shoulder surgery because a majority of his “soft” goals was glove side shoulder.
Galdom
Happy Sunday Lehner haters. You guys are going to hate the second half.
knights fan in minny
how is the football world in vegas like there new coaching hire
THE hockey GOD
football , what is that ? National Kneelers and Entitlement league ?
THE hockey GOD
GREAT ARTICLE KEVIN I. My favorite line Lehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated.” Spot on. However, if you watch experts around the league from NHL to TSN to Hockey Night in Canada they are all consistent with many accolades for RL. He has won the Masterton , Calder, and Jennings Trophies.
Time to add SC to that list.
Hdbiker7851
No it’s not killing anyone they are thankful and hopeful it will continue. To argue back and forth the diff eff tence between 88.6 and 87.2 is stupid – both numbers are shit. The litmus test is what happens going forward but for KH is the reason vegas wins the Cup is plain stupid. Teams win the Cup and the last few games the entire club has done a better job. When they play 60 minutes they have a better than average chance of coming out on top otherwise its anyone’s guess. What’s amazing is those who give RL a pass for shitty performance while condemning MAF. One has zero to do with the others but it keeps going on. If Lehner can stay with it and stay on his skates he has a chance if he doesn’t and needs to move around he is toast or a fish out of water for those who don’t know the difference.
Julie
Amen, HD. If emotions are kept in check, this isn’t hard at all. The need to skewer Fleury to convince us how great Lehner is a false premise. Neither have an impact on the other.
It’s usually appropriate that when a player has given his all, i.e., led a team to SC finals the first year of an expansion team, etc. – then leaves, for people left behind to say “thank you for all of hard work”. While Fleury was in Vegas, comparing the two was fair game given how it was managed. Now, it’s a sad state that Lehner fans are still harping about Fleury. Reminds me of that saying, “thou dost protest too much”. Maybe the more they post about Lehner, the more they are trying to convince themselves that Lehner is indeed THE man because there are no other options. Whatever the reason, to trash Fleury now after he is gone to build up Lehner in our eyes is a sign of desperation. Like you said, if he can stay with it we’ll see. Til then, this tack taken (I guess because of a tweet – which if that and costing 1 goal in a game is enough to ditch Fleury after all he accomplished with the Knights) is useless noise meant to distract and attract more site visitors.
THE hockey GOD
@Julie, complete spin out and mis- characterization of hate that the fans are spewing on RL. Even the author didn’t go into this fantasy land projection.
Sara Agas
Actually what is really sad is that every article/post that is about Lehner especially one that is complementary has to have a comment about Fleury. How he is the better tender….
Daryl
Actually that isn’t true at all…. MAF is continually brought up by those who support RL as they try to shoe comparison in numbers. If the RL supporters wouldn’t bring up MAF, his name would almost never get mentioned on here
Daryl
I couldn’t agree more. There are posters on this site who have stated they do not like MAF and most of their posts re based on their personal feelings toward him and not his actions on the ice. They consistently assume negative things with no proof to back any of it up. They say when RL doesn’t play well, it’s the defenses fault. Not a shot that goes by him is his fault. It’s hilarious listening to some of them. RL has played great the past 4 games and he’s been helped by the defense which has played even better, evident by only giving up 9 shits and 1 high danger shit in the first 40min of the last game. But if you listen to some on here, it was ALL RL
Julie
It’s official – Ken B and Galdon are the same people.
Next he will tell us Alec Baldwin is not responsible for the death of the cinematographer on the Rust movie set.
Objectivity is merely an illusion..
knights fan in minny
alec baldy needs to fry
Galdom
Who the fuck is Ken B? Is this some American politics thing that I won’t understand? Alec Baldwin? I don’t even know which hockey team that guy plays for. Please don’t answer those questions I don’t care. I’m just happy that Robin Lehner stole four points on this road trip. I’d like to see the offence pick it up and Lehner build on this great week. I think any reasonable VGK would want the same thing.
Again, thank you Kevin Iole for your work and writing an article for us.
THE hockey GOD
@ galdom ‘who the f is Ken B.? I believe that is reference to Ken Boehlke the author/writer for 99% of articles on this site. For some odd reason that poster thinks you and Ken B are same person.
Galdom
Oh ok. I’m Ken Boehlke. Ok Julie, if you say so. I’m okay with that. He’s done a great job. Cool dude. He’s done a great job with this website. I don’t always agree with everything he says but I really respect his opinion.
THE hockey GOD
another one of those “highly unsophisticated” posters, ignore the losers. Galdom
Lehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated
hdbiker7851
Julie – I am sure you notice as does everyone else the Lehner “lovers” want to pat him on the back regardless of shitty performance, conversely want to piss on MAF regardless how good his performance was while in Vegas – pretty sad – Like you said the appropriate thing to do, as you suggested would be to just say thank you. That would be “class” which unfortunately doesn’t exist here. Vegas fans have no idea just how fortunate they are to have a team that has experienced the success they have.
knights fan in minny
nabber gets extended
THE hockey GOD
Ozark odds line for next character to be offed when series returns
– Omar Navarro ,ex Mexican drug cartel “jefe” 3 to 1 (why because
when it becomes known he trysted with FBI his associates don’t like rats
– Javier Emilio Elizondro aka Javi, Omar’s over ambitious nephew odds 5/2. Why?
well Ruth Langmore . Say no more.
– FBI agent Maya Miller. 2 to 1. Why ? She went rogue and arrested Omar.
– New sheriff Guerro, 8 to 1. Why ? Javi likes to kill sheriffs.
– Ruth Langmore 15 to 1. Why ? Javi knows she helped the Snells, and she is on his list.
– Wendy Byrde , 15 to 1, Why? Omar is ‘greatly disappointed , especially you Wendy”
– Marty Byrd. 50 to 1, Why ? He’s main character, and director of series.
– Magnum PI, the private investigator, don’t know his name. Nell Sattem. 9 to 1. Why ? He only wants a signature for divorce papers for Helen (drug cartel lawyer, who they knocked off). But he’s bit off more than he can chew. Surely Omar knows about him. He knows everything about the Byrds.
-Ruth’s brother Three Langmore. 75 to 1. Minor Character.
– Ruth’s aunt who sells the flower seeds. 100 to 1 , Minor Character.
– Sam, the idiot, manager for Ruth’s Lazy O’ Motel, 30 to 1. He’s bound to screw something else up. Minor character.
– FBI agent Clay (Miller’s boss) and her boss FBI agent bald headed guy 7 to 1, why? Because they double crossed the Byrds and Omar with their dealings.
– Charlotte and Jonah Byrde (off spring of Marty/Wendy) 50 to 1 and 25 to 1. Why? Jonah is OUT of family and in deep shit with Snells.
– Frank Jr. (son of offed KC Mobster), 50 to 1 he’s “untouchable”.
– Nelson Bonilla/ Jackson – Helen and Omar’s “luca braci” strong arm. 15 to 1. Ruth is out for revenge. She’s knows who he is.
– Harry, Bryds’ Funeral home director , 75 to 1. (unless somehow he gets involved
with Javi and refuses to incinerate someone when Marty is not around). Minor Character.
– Erin Pierce- Helen (drug cartel now offed lawyer) daughter. Now enlightened about her mother’s dealings. 30 to 1. Minor character.
– Jade the stripper, ex fiance of idiot Sam, 100 to 1. Minor character.
– FBI agent Trevor Evans, 100 to 1, now delegated to minor character status.
– baby zeke, 1000 to 1; Omar “we don’t kill children”. Minor character.
– Rachel Garrison, partner/ owner of Blue Cat Cafe/ cabins. 40 to 1. Why? Hardly seen in season 4 after she ODed in prior season, clearly in Marty’s back pocket.
– Jim Rattlesdorf, Wendy Byrde’s new liar, I mean lawyer. Politician. Javier thinks he’s family lawyer in USA for drug cartel. 10 to 1. Why? see prior sentence and what happened to Helen prior “family” lawyer.
– KC MOB. 80 to 1. Why? Well don’t be surprised if Frank Jr. sympathizes with Ruth and “may” try to help her out and , come on, who’s going to take out KC MOB? Well maybe the mexican cartel. Dun dun dun dun dun dun.
– Mexican Cartel in USA. 50 to 1. See KC Mob above.
Did I Miss anyone ?
THE hockey GOD
oh yeah, one more very important odds line. We know season four part one opened with Byrd’s in car crash. And we know season four part 1 ended with Bryd’s moving back to Chicago So .
The odds of season four part two opening with follow up of car crash scene: One to one.
Odds that one Byrde is killed in car crash: 10 to 1
Odds that two Byrdes are killed in car crash : 30 to 1
Odds that three Byrdes are killed car crash: 50 to 1.
Odds that all four Byrdes are killed 250 to 1, we know Jonah did not want to
go with them.
The odds god.
Arnold Rothstein
What’s the spread
and over/under , and money line?
Arnold
the
Brain
Galdom
I’m extremely happy with the way Robin Lehner is turning the season around. I’m not here to insult anybody and you can check every single post I have ever did they never have words like idiot, moron and stuff like that. I never crucify anybody for disagreeing with me, I just like to debate it somewhat intelligently. Bottom line is I am a huge Vegas Golden Knights fan and a huge Robin Lehner fan and this has been a big week for me and I am happy about that.
THE hockey GOD
me too, Galdom. I hear ya.
But I refuse to back down, everyone who insulted me started it first. I will not take BS from anyone.
I don’t start it, but I will not fail to finish it.
Galdom
Thank you for the update Knights fan in Minny. Brayden McNabb took a hometown discount, no doubt about that. Wow!
knights fan in minny
money is not everything i guess
Tim
All you posters with the crystal I think should take a breath. Forget the stats what counts is how he plays in the playoffs and at the moment no one has a clue. The only undisputed fact is he will be our goalie. After the playoffs you’ll have enough time to praise him or roast him and all your questions will be answered.
THE hockey GOD
@ tim, nothing is “undisputed” in game of hockey.
NOTHING.
Tim
THG, if you think Lehner may not be our playoff goalie I’ve got a bridge I’ll sell you.
THE hockey GOD
I didn’t say that TIM
I said NOTHING is undisputed.
EVERY HEAR OF GETTING INJURED ???? When is getting hurt UNDISPUTED?
So you are saying RL is somehow immune from an injury from now until when playoff start ? Pray tell how that immunity works ? I am sure the FO , and rest of league would like to know that trick !! (messing with you buddy, and I think you know it)
Daryl
I disagree with the 2nd paragraph…. If you had said his game against the Caps or the first two periods against TB, then I would agree
THE hockey GOD
Really .886 or .872 not much difference. Multiplying by 1000 that comes out
to 88.6 versus 87.2 , on a grading scale (depending on the sample size). That could be difference between someone getting a B versus a C, especially if the cut off point is 88.0 Or a B+ versus a B. But neither is failing grade.
Richie-Rich
LOL. If you are an NHL goalie with a sub .900 sv% you get an F – period.
Look, let’s just hope RL continues playing at this past week’s level the rest of the year!
Galdom
Richie Rich, it would be a tall order to play at last weeks level but as long as he gives us competence we really should be in good shape. I guess we really should also mention that Brossoit played well against Carolina especially considering it was his first game in three weeks.
Richie-Rich
For sure. Last week he had an almost .970 sv%, at his low about .886. If he can split the difference that would be great, even that is above his career average.
I was impressed with his positioning, anticipation and his glove and stick were much more consistent this past week.
Keep it up.
THE hockey GOD
galdom you will never satisfy these people, they are clueless.
THE hockey GOD
I as speaking strictly in terms of statistics, not NHL goalies. AS prefaced by “ona grading scale” and furthered by “depending on sample size”. Learn to fucking read.
But taking your point, ever hear of the following goalies ?
56 CA Grant Fuhr 1962 868 3.38 0.887
133 CA Ron Hextall 1964 608 2.98 0.895
369 277 38 44 135 0 48 48 437
142 CA Wayne Stephenson 1945 328 3.07 0.892 146 103 14 18 309 0 3 3 43
143 CA Andy Moog 1960 713 3.14 0.892 372 209 28 40 130 0 24 24 230
144 CA Glenn Resch 1948 571 3.28 0.891 231 224 26 32 214 0 16 16 70
145 CA Wayne Thomas 1947 243 3.34 0.891 103 93 10 13 743 0 7 7 41
146 CA Dan Bouchard 1950 656 3.27 0.890 286 233 27 37 909 0 28 28 255
147 CA Bob Froese 1958 242 3.10 0.890 128 72 13 13 433 0 10 10 90
148 CA Mike Vernon 1963 782 2.98 0.890 385 274 27 44 501 0 39 39 271
149 CA Denis Herron 1952 462 3.71 0.889 146 203 10 25 550 0 9 9 89
150 CA Mike Palmateer 1954 356 3.53 0.888 149 138 17 20 084 0 25 25 118
and many more, below 0.900
care to modify your statement ?????
Richie-Rich
I’m actually shaking my head because I don’t see anything after 1964 there…..
Okay. I will just concede the point.
THE hockey GOD
boy you never heard of Grant Fuhr, or Ron Hextall ? BTW they didn’t keep save percentage stats prior to 1964. All of these are after 1964.
The only ones on that list are Glenn Hall and Terry Sawchuck, who I left off because the save % for them wasn’t listed. Clueless and unsophesticated. Author got that right.
Richie-Rich
Let me make a correction here.
I am NOT an RL hater at all. Never have been.
I am an RL doubter, that’s it and that is as far as it goes, period. He’s never been accepted anywhere for a reason, or for multiple reasons. He hasn’t won anything and his stats do not warrant my “love”. I don’t hate nor do I love players.
I am a VGK fan and I want to see this team win, yes even with RL in goal. But, I am not going to sit back and heap praise on a goaltender when he’s playing poorly. RL needs to continue to play at the level he played last week. If he does, I will be the first to continue to heap the praise upon him.
Daryl
Come on RR…. You are wither a lover or a hater. If you criticize any part of his game you are a hater
Galdom
Richie Rich, That sounds like a reasonable statement by someone who is actually a VGK fan.
THE hockey GOD
how about saying if the TEAM continues to play this way, putting it on goalie is not fair at all as the author says. Your penchant to unfairly blame the goalie during this spat of games has been noted by author, and others as well.
RL seems to play better in SO and OT, when his defense doesn’t muck things up in front of his own net. Example no. 2 playing pachinko or pinball with puck in his crease.
THE hockey GOD
doubter hater, same thing.
THE hockey GOD
to me it sounds like
“ehner, for some reason, has become the whipping boy for the VGK fans and it’s highly unfair and highly unsophisticated. “
Galdom
Whether you guys agree with my views or not you have to admit that is pretty cool for me that a professional sports writer who actually gets paid for his opinion (Kevin Iole) writes an article that basically is a facsimile of what I have been saying. It’s all there for all of you to read. We both think that Lehner is treated unfairly. We both think that he deserved to take Fleury’s job in 2019-20 for that particular season. We both think that any of Fluery’s shortcomings are overlooked because of his personality, the way the fans love him and his smile. We all know that if Lehner made that gaffe against Montreal it would be a different story. I don’t really agree that Lehner has had a good first half though.
Just because a professional sports writer and an extremely intelligent fan (Galdom, just kidding) agree it doesn’t mean that what we say is gospel. It’s a free country and you can disagree. but I hope you can understand that it’s comforting for me and my stance to have a pro agree with me.
Daryl
You do realize that he is nothing more than a VGK fan and he does not get paid to write articles on VGK hockey. This article should be viewed similar to you or anyone else writing an article
Galdom
He is employed by Yahoo Sports as a sports columnist. He is a professional sports writer. He gets paid for it. If you play hockey and get paid for it you are a professional hockey player. He is a professional sports writer. For Yahoo sports. He writes about combat sports mainly but also other sports as well.
https://sports.yahoo.com/lifelong-penguins-supporter-became-diehard-golden-knights-fan-220630321.html
Here is a link of one of his articles from Yahoo sports where he’s talking about being a Pittsburgh Penguins fan and then transitioning to a Vegas golden knights fan.
Darryl, do you get paid by Yahoo sports to be a professional sports writer? Has Ken Boehkle asked you to write a Sunday column.
It’s okay to disagree with Kevin Iole’s opinion, i’m sure he would say the same. But he is a professional sports writer and I’m sure he would dispute you saying that he is not.
Daryl
My point is he is a hockey fan not a hockey expert. Ken may pay him to write an article here and there but that doesn’t make him an expert. I’ve been paid to be an analysts in Myrtle Beach at a couple MMA events and love hockey but that doesn’t make me a hockey expert. SinBin has also had an attorney who loves VGK hockey write articles, but again that doesn’t make him an exoeet
I wasn’t saying anything negative about him. Yes I know he was a Pens fan and then became a vgk fan. I have nothing against him, he is just giving his opinion
Galdom
Ken Boehlke is not doing this website for free. This is his full-time job. I would know. According to Julie I am Ken Boehlke. (Rolling my eyes). I am sure with some of the revenue that he is generating he is paying Kevin Iole to write Sunday articles. And again, Kevin Iole is a professional sports writer getting paid by Yahoo as well.
KEVIN IOLE IS A PROFESSIONAL SPORTS WRITER.
THE hockey GOD
@ Galdom, it’s useless to respond to this piece of shit, all he does is twist and spin. You have him spinning so much his head is vomiting. When you catch him in a lie, he spins it someplace else. He’s an idiot. All he does is troll and troll and troll. A true hater, SMH post above describes his ilk to a tee.
Daryl
Didn’t you say you don’t call people names and here you are responding to a post while calling someone else a POS. Let me guess, I’m twisting your words around!!!! You are nothing more than a keyboard warrior. You run your mouth behind a computer.
where the Buffalo roam
Vgk just signed extensions with McNabb, Amadio, and Logan Thompson.
a suspicious fan would say, hey, does that mean that they are going to trade Smith and Brossoit, and keep Martinez on the LTIR, cuz if they did they would create over $11mill in cap space for a certain new star center to start playing.
Richie-Rich
Need to check the deals! Yeah, I could see Thompson coming up.
Daryl
I wonder how much more Whitecloud will get next season. And I thought Martinez was close to returning
Galdom
Whitecloud has been signed to an extension. I think you meant Hague. I’m assuming that Hague has got to get pretty much the same thing that whitecloud got. 2.725 million per year.
Daryl
You are correct, I meant Hague…. with what Whitecloud will be making (around $3m?) and then what Hague will get, next years Cap will be interesting
Blitz
Whitecloud deal is already done. He is going from 725k this season to 2.75mil next. Mcnabb is going from 2.5mil to 2.85mil. So quick math says VGK will now need to find another +2.375 mil in cap space next year. With a flat cap it is going to be hard to find. This team is so fucked. Exit more talented players enter more bottom earners. Top heavy as fuck.
THE hockey GOD
better to have more than less , eh Blitz ?
I expect one of top guns to be gone after this season.
7, 61, or 67
take your pick. Two of three are damaged goods.
AlaskaBorn
Signing McNabb give the front office another asset to trade.
where the Buffalo roam
McNabb’s three-year extension carries an average annual value of $2.85MM, Amadio’s two-year deal carries an average annual value of $762,500 and Thompson’s three-year deal is worth $766,667 per year. All three contracts begin in the 2022-23 season.
Rob S.
Dear Lord, *why* would they extend McNabb (or, as he’s known around my house, “F-ing McNabb”)? Okay, he’s the last master of the hip check into the side wall and he occasionally gets in the way of a shot but SERIOUSLY!? He is painfully slow, he doesn’t process the game quickly (that is, he makes bad decisions–especially about moving the puck–slowly) which makes him a turnover machine, and he is a clumsy skater who falls down on his own 3-4 times a game. Oh, and he’s absolutely hopeless on the offensive end.
My one ray of hope about next year’s roster was that he would be gone as an UFA. Now we’re stuck with him for *3* more years!? This (3 years x $2.85 mil) is in Ken’s words, “a strong deal.” For one of the five worst D-men in the entire league? For a partner who makes Pietrangelo or Theodore worse for having to lug him around the ice? I always assumed McNabb had pictures of Foley and the Splash Bros, but maybe he has some of Ken, too?
Seriously, Ken, next time you are looking for a topic for one of your excellent video breakdowns, could you do one on McNabb and explain to me why you think he’s even a moderately competent NHL-level D-man? I’d really like to know. I keep hearing the praise and I keep seeing something entirely different when I watch the games. I’m a long-time hockey watcher, but I grew up in the south and never played, so perhaps there are things that I am missing about “inside” hockey that make him good?
Daryl
He’s a defenseman, he isn’t out there to score goals. We have Theo and Petra specifically for that reason and it really isn’t working out very well. We need a big guy to help clear the crease and move the puck. At some point your blueliners have to play defense
Rob S.
If that’s your argument for McNabb, “you got nothin’.” And *that* is the problem.
Daryl
Sure, why do we need anyone to block shots? Why do we need anyone to clear the crease, especially on PK? Why do we need a big guy to win board battles?
He is also a +8 and has more takeaways then giveaways.
So I guess “you got nothin”
SMH
McNabb brings an element of size, physicality, and stay-at-home defense that the rest of our defenders don’t quite have. He leads the NHL in blocked shots so far this year (note that Pietrangelo is also top 10 in blocked shots, despite his reputation as a more offensive-minded D-man). Yes, I know McNabb is a poor skater, and I know he brings very little offensive game, but he’s the type of guy that opposing forwards have to think twice about getting checked hard if they’re not careful, and at the modest price ($2.85/yr), I believe he’s a solid veteran option to continue to man the back end while Hague, Pietrangelo, or Theodore are up the ice trying to drive offense.
And while Amadio doesn’t excite me (he seems like a capable 13th or 14th forward, so no problem having him on the roster at the league minimum), I think that the Thompson signing could potentially be a steal if his recent AHL success translates into becoming a solid NHL #2 goalie, which he showed signs of in his recent 1st NHL start. If VGK can get away with paying their #2 goalie the league minimum for the next 3 years, that would definitely help the salary cap.
THE hockey GOD
actually the D man from Florida leads league in blocked shots, according to the Panther announcers.
But SMH once again you are the voice of reason, punishing the VGK haters, left and right. Kudos to you for pointing out the obvious to the unsophisticated fans.
Turk Broda
Never forget that it was McNabb who allowed Barclay Goodrow to skate right around him on the outside, then cut in front of the net untouched by McNabb and score the winning goal in OT in the notorious game 7 vs SJ
Galdom
Thanks again Ken Boehlke for the work that you do in providing this website. I’m also hoping that Kevin Iole who is a professional sports writer for Yahoo sports and an award-winning journalist will continue to provide articles as well.
AlaskaBorn
The analytic stat that is used the most (other than wins) to determine the Vezina is the GSAA. What is Lehners currently?
Galdom
https://moneypuck.com/goalies.htm
I’ve posted this link about five times but no one responds to it because it makes my point. As per your request AlaskaBorn. See above attached link. Robin Lehner ranks 14th out of 106 goalies. Marc-André Fleury ranks 102nd.
Galdom
True Blitz. They are completely fucked! They’ve become the Toronto Maple Leafs, too top-heavy. This season could be their last real shot.
Mike StG
Some facts on assessing goalies (in this case RL): GSAE – goals saved above expected – is a more accurate measure of performance than simple save percentage. For RL, the first 20 games this szn he was somewhere between 4th – 8th in the league. After a not-so-good stretch over the next 20 games he slid down to the 12th – 14th range. So he’s still in the upper half of starting goalies. We will have to see how he plays the rest of this szn, but his historical numbers have been really consistent thruout his career across all 4 teams he played for. BTW, Fleury for me was a joy to watch and I was sad to see him moved. Would’ve been great to raise his number to the rafters of TMA. He’ll be a 1st ballot HOFer.
On McNabb: he’s been one of the best defenders in the league off the rush for the past 3 years. From JFresh today: “Per All Three Zones, in the past two seasons respectively he ranks 99th and 98th percentile among defencemen in preventing controlled entries and 89th and 94th percentile in preventing chances off of entry attempts.” For me, the ‘eye test’ of critical fans who don’t realize his value
isn’t worth much. For what he brings to the team his contract extension is team friendly, less than $3M and with only a slight increase over his current salary.
On Amaddio: good signing and value. He, Howden, and Patrick are a good line that will probably stay together (with KK an alternative based on available forwards). Plus all 4 are young, the age group that VGK has needed to fill on their roster.
On Logan: it appears the FO has hopes for him to develop into an NHL goalie. If he continues his development curve I could see him possibly moving up to the NHL in 2 years.
Galdom
https://moneypuck.com/goalies.htm
Be careful Mike StG. If you are correct and GSAE is a better measure than save percentage than everyone on this forum is going to hate you especially if they click on this link above.
Because just as you stated Lehner ranks 14th. But it might shock others to see who ranks 102nd out of 106 goalies.
Yikes!!!
Daryl
Different people view stats differently.. People throw out this stat and that start, funny thing is every stat days something different. And every stat is affected by the talent and play around them. Which is another reason why you can’t rely on stats. As I said before VGK is a playoff contending team and the Hawks are not. You can pt the best goalie ever on a very bad team and his stats will not look very good. They’re is no excuse for RL not to have better overall stats simply due to the quality of players, especially defense around him. And I’m not talking about W/L re ord, I’m talking about defense
THE hockey GOD
?? Sam Montembeault??
Galdom
Flower
Pistol Pete
Those who ready this board regularly know I join Galdom, sb and others as a Lehner supporter. It’s become clear the FO acted wisely in acquiring the younger Lehner in favor of the aging Fleury. I would like to remind the readers of the postseason stats:
Fleury: W 90/L 70—GA 2.53—SV % .912
Lehner: W 14/L 14—GA 2.19—SV % .918
We can see the sample size for Fleury is much larger and he has a 20 game win margin vs. Lehner’s .500. Fleury though enjoyed the extensive support of those PIT Cup winning teams. In any case, it’s hard to understand how the Lehner detractors remain intractable with postseason stats like his.
Vasilevskiy postseason:
W 49/L29—GA 2.24—SV% .924
The nice win margin enabled in part by the TBL winning roster and a larger sample size compared to Lehner, otherwise Lehner’s postseason stats compared to Vasilevskiy are very respectable…very.
Pistol Pete
The Lehner detractors will have a field day if Lehner performs poorly this postseason. I guess that is something they can look to.
Daryl
Let me ask you something PP. Is there a difference between one side or the other? RL has played great these past 4 games and they’re isn’t a single one of us who had said otherwise. Even though it was a very soft goa against TBL that let them tie the game. But when RL has a bad game how many on gets come to his side and blame the defense? If you listen to thg and smh, RL had never had a bad game yet, it’s always been someone else’s fault!!!
Most of us on here want VGK to win. I personally f don’t think they can do that with RL. I said last year and before this year started, RL is capabable of having some great games, they just don’t seem to last. And he always seems to let in a soft goal when the team really reds a save similar to the TBL game. He had the same problem 2 years ago, he would play good all game long then let in an easy goal late in the 3rd.
Julie
Daryl, bottom line is the pushers of Lehner won’t let it go because they need a hero. No one fits that bill for them. Attacking Fleury is just another way to say they never got what they wanted. Crying over Fleury now because no one else but maybe 3 boys on the site want Lehner to be their savior is a twisted state of affairs. I have seen this before in children, stamping their feet, little fists in the air. Almost as silly as the Ozark recaps on a hockey site. Let’s see what Lehner does and hope for the best. In the meantime, I will continue hoping that this nonsense stops. With some of these “fans”, Vegas needs a lot more help.
Pistol Pete
Broadly speaking the VGK fan base was wed to Fleury so the breakup has been tough. Given that, a number of fans are going to question bringing in any other goalie whose career does not measure up to Fleury’s. I think the FO made the correct decision that the team would be no more likely to win a Cup with Fleury than another top level type goaltender at this stage in Fleury’s career. Whether Lehner works out we will see this postseason—until then it’s a lot of guessing, some of it better informed than the rest of it. To get the best assessment one can to turn to people like Darren Eliot and Mike McKenna both of whom tended goal at the NHL level.
Richie-Rich
PP,
MAF is long gone now. Why are we still talking about him.
For me, the single most important discussion point when it comes to goaltending is whether or not Lehner has finally found a home and can take his game both on and off the court to a new level.
The entire MAF discussion is in my rear view window. Period and I won’t be bringing it up again after this post – ever regardless of how many times THG baits the hook. That drum has been beaten so hard and I am sick of hearing about the SWORD and all of that bullshit.
I gave RL credit for a great road trip even after giving up on him around January 15th when he had an .872 or .886 sv%. Now, he’s on life support with me. He can fully recover or go right back into subpar funk.
Others have said it, I will say it. VGK is a 3rd place team in any other division than the Pacific. Inconsistency, poor power play, below average defense and goaltending are not going to win a Stanley Cup. ADDITIONALLY, the VGK was deservedly ranked in the top 3 over the past few years. NOT this year. Before this road trip they would ranked around 12th in the NHL and for GOOD REASON (all of the reasons I have previously stated plus coaching). Why the Special Teams coach is still employed is beyond comprehension.
When you see your team struggling for identity, the GM rolling the dice over and over and over again in the trade market and coming up short is why I feel the way I do.
Stone, Pacioretty and Martinez are long in the tooth and this may be the last year that these three might be able to help bring a SC to Vegas.
With that said, the future is pretty bright as we have some great young players sitting in the wings on the HSK roster, and we have some good young talent on the team now with Roy and Hague and a few others.
Let’s stop talking about MAF!
Daryl
PP,
I completely agree with everything you have stated! And so others may understand, I did not become a fan of VGK because of MAF. My favorite player has always been Engelland. I followed him from minors to Pens, to Flames and to VGK. I’ve always like MAF but more so his personality. I do think the FO panicked slightly when MAF was playing bad but at the same time I don’t completely blame them. But once they acquired RL, I was all for trading MAF as it made the most sense. I’m not ill at all about RL being here. I’ve said he is a good goalie multiple times. I was hard on MAF when he was having a bad year and that he should take some time away to get his head straight. It’s just on this site, if you are critical of RL for anything, others bring up MAF in an attempt to show that he wasn’t any better
And my comment about Iole. Again, I never said anything negative toward him but he is a combat sport reporter which doesn’t translate into a hockey expert. I train MMA as well, I’ve trained and been a sparring partner of Derek Brunson, and more recently of John Salter and Joe Solecki. Most of you may not know who those guys even are. My point is, just b/c I get paid to help train some of these professional fighters doesn’t automatically make me an expert on hockey as well.
Julie
The point of all of this is to see what Lehner can do – and leave Fleury out of it. Pretty sure Lehner doesn’t compare himself to Fleury.
People here are posting incessantly about something that doesn’t matter.
Doesn’t matter if people wanted Fleury to stay or go. He is gone. Doesn’t matter if people care for Lehner or not. You can’t force people to like a person. A lot of that is because of Lehner, not Fleury, btw.
This was nothing more than a ploy to get more people to the site. It may have worked initially, but I am willing to bet it turned a lot of people off too. Who starts a family feud over whether little brother is as tall as bigger brother? I have never seen a group of people start such a meaningless illogical argument with such passion over something not relevant. Except maybe Coke vs Pepsi.
We are all here because we root for Vegas. There are bigger fish to fry this season to Richie’s and HD’s points. I hope the articles get better here on out. You seem like a nice person, Pete. All of your points are well-taken. I just think it’s time to move on.
Richie-Rich
Pepsi is better than Coke!
Daryl
RR,
Not a chance in hell… Unless you are talking about Pepsi Zero then I would agree!!!
Richie-Rich
Definitely Pepsi Zero Daryl. No sugar!
Wedgeworth
Lehner has been average at best this season, stats don’t lie. He hasn’t stolen many games and has given a way a fair number of leads. Look at what Kahkonen in doing in Minnesota or Husso in St Louis. Vegas is a great team, but for me that missing ingredient of eliteness in net will be their undoing in the playoffs.
Galdom
Yes Wedgewood, for the first half of the season Robin Lehner has been pretty much average at best. No disagreement here. he hasn’t stolen many games. And if a goalie isn’t playing well in the playoffs that will be the undoing of any team.
But the main argument for myself is the love affair that this fan base has with Fleury makes most very negative on Lehner. He has never been horrible. His porous defence gave him no help. For the past four games he has been simply spectacular. Will probably be named one of the three stars of the NHL this week. And most not all don’t want to give him credit for that.
Trying to convince people is like a lawyers nightmare. You can bring up any statistic to make your point and then you will be told that the statistic is being interpreted incorrectly. Then you can bring up how a professional sports writer shares your opinion and then the credentials of the sports writer are criticized. It is what it is. People love Fluery and will never give Lenher a fair shake and it is what it is. Life isn’t always fair.
Daryl
Galdom,
How many on here have no given RL credit for the past couple games? Who on here has said he hasn’t played great lately? You say most will not give him credit, and I may have overlooked a post or two, but I haven’t seen anyone not give him credit.
And as for MAF, it’s those defending RL that continually bring up MAF. They try to compare RL stats to MAF stats, etc. It’s not those who criticize RL who bring up MAF
And I know part of your Comme t is directed at me b/c you bring up stats which I have said for years stats are not the end all. Stats taken out of context, especially during covid times aren’t exact. And again you reference me when talking about a sports writer. He may know a lot about a certain sport but that doesn’t en he knows a lot about another sport. I guess in your mind sports writers knows everything about every sport simply b/c they wrote about one sport. Smh
Galdom
I’m exhausted
Daryl
That’s funny.! I asked a legit question of how many have not given RL credit because you say he doesn’t get any and your response to that is I’m exhausted. I guess you don’t have an actual answer for me seeing as you were wrong on your statement
Galdom
Oh okay. 4
Or maybe 14
I don’t even care. A couple of people after Washington game said that Lehner didn’t even make any big saves and that the shots all hit him in the chest. I don’t wanna go back and look at all those comments and then name each and every person. Last time I called people out one of them told me to go fuck myself. ROTFL
Who cares. I’m exhausted meaning I’m done talking about it.
Lehner is here. I enjoy watching him play. People who love Fleury so much can go watch the Chicago Blackhawks. Watching his acrobatic style which leads to him not stopping any more pucks than Lehner does. To each their own.
I’m a VGK fan and I support Robin Lehner. Free country I think.
Daryl
Yeah, thats what I thought…. again, you try to all me out but without using my name. Against the Caps, I made the comment about the low number of high danger chances, which is a FACT. I made a comment about Ovi and his one timer not getting many chances and that his only real shot hit RL in the face. That isn’t taking away from RL having a great game, that is praising the defense for being outstanding. Then in the FLA game, I quoted the Panthers commentator about FLA needing to stop using the slap shot and use more of a wrist shot b/c most of the pucks were hitting RL in the chest. AGAIN, that isn’t being negative on RL. It’s praising him for being in the right position.
The problem is, your love with RL makes every statement that isn’t outright 100% positive for him look like it’s a negative comment.
So there were between 4 and 14 people who said RL didn’t play great and give them credit for anything on this road trip??? Yeah, this conversation is pointless
Galdom
I personally have absolutely nothing left to add on Robin Lehner. NOTHING!!!
I’m actually a very big Brayden McNabb fan. My thoughts have been that this team has lost a bit of its identity and physical style. And I think he took a hometown discount, I could’ve seen him getting upwards of 4 million on the open market. He’s a top four defenceman.
However….. you can’t keep everybody and I certainly thought that he would be a casualty of the cap crunch. I would have let him go. You gotta turn over that roster at some point. Just like Nick Roy replaced Cody Eakin, Nick Hague replaced Deryk Engelland, I figured that white cloud has become a top four defenceman it has made McNabb expendable.
Pistol Pete
Richie-Rich, with respect to your extensive laundry list of VGK deficiencies supporting your implication they are middling decent team, we’ll find out one way or the other in the playoffs. The best team on paper or in the regular season is not always the one to win the Cup.
Daryl
Caps are a prime example
Richie-Rich
PP,
I am just giving you one man’s unqualified opinion based on watching this team as a season ticket holder. This opinion isn’t just a snapshot, it is a evaluation of the team over the past several years since expansion.
This FO has rolled the dice and has put VGK in CAP hell with the top line being over the age of 30. That means it is looking to “buy a Cup”. I think you would have to agree that is a fair assumption. The good thing is that they have a lot of depth and young players.
The rest of this season is definitely going to be interesting. It would be fantastic to see Lehner succeed and for Stone, Patches, Petro and Martinez to all win a cup here this year.
We definitely will find out!
Daryl
What worries me is while VGK has some young talent, I don’t see any stars that will be able to replace the old talent that they have. I’m not sure who can play on the 1st two lines. I do think VGK went all in in order to win a Cup now, which is ok, but I don’t think you can do that with disregard for the future. Every team wants to win now and will spend money to win now, but you can forget about the future in doing so. All that does is kill your team for the years to come
Galdom
There’s nothing to talk about. If I provide stats to try to prove a point but they are completely disregarded because in your opinion they are not interpreted correctly then it really is all just a waste of time. The conversation has gone on too long.
In the end I guess I sort of got my way because the guy I like better plays for my team and the guy you and most others like better plays for Chicago. it’s an inenviable position to be in to be a VGK fan but not like the goalie. So I’m lucky in this regard.
Pistol Pete
Lol.
Daryl
If you say so… Again, you want to bring up a goalie who is not with VGK for absolutely no reason. MAF has nothing to do with any conversation on here so I don’t know why you continue to bring him up. And as I’ve stated on multiple occasions, as soon as RL was acquired, the only smart move was to trade MAF. So I don’t get this whole my goalie is here and your goalie is gone
But as you said, I’m done with it
Galdom
Also, I will be extremely disappointed if Justin Gaethje doesn’t get to fight Charles Oliveira next. Gaethje was always my 2nd favourite after Khabib and I took huge satisfaction in watching him completely destroy Ferguson. That was a murder.
Daryl
Gaethje should be the next up for Oliveira, who will be the favored fighter. The winner of that fight will probably face Makhachev if he is able to easily beat Dariush. I don’t see an instant rematch of Oliveira/Gaethje no matter who wins
Daryl
The only thing that could change any of this is if McGregor returns. That could throw a wrench into everything
Galdom
I am a massive MMA fan. In regards to knowledge of what is actually going on when the fighters get to the ground I really have no idea. I think 95% of people don’t either. But I still enjoy it regardless. The commentators explaining what’s going on definitely helps. Lol
Daryl
I agree 100%…. fans will see a player get taken down and they think he is about to be submitted or whatnot but you will hear commentators say he is in good position. Sometimes things look really bad for a fighter but really he isn’t in that bad of shape at all.
Pistol Pete
That road trip, overall defending was excellent as was the bottom six. Playoffs grade hockey versus some of the top teams in the league. Definitely a foundation to build on.
Pistol Pete
It will be interesting to see how Eichel fits in with what hopefully continues to be a successful VGK defend first foundation.
Daryl
The interesting part of having Eichel is 1) who else does VGK had to move and how will that move affect the other lines; and 2) what type of chemistry will the Eichel line have? Eichel can be the best player ever but if there is no chemistry b/n him and his linesmates, it won’t matter how good he is.
Galdom
October 6, 2018 was one of the most satisfying sports moments of my life being a big Khabib fan. Being a Nurmagomedov fan was more painful then being a Lehner fan.
Always being told that he is boring.
Daryl
Khabib was an amazing fighter… I have doubts whether he would finished undefeated if he fought Cerrone or Fergurson earlier in his career or even if he gave McGregor a rematch. He pulled out of two fights against Cerrone when both were in their prime and he did it against twice against Fergurson. I think he loses one of those two fights. There is a reason he refused to give McGregor a rematch, I have no idea what that reason is, but he even said he wouldn’t give Conor a chance. I know there was bad blood between the two but that is bad sportsmanship.
But nobody can deny that he was a great fighter. I question his motive for retiring simply b/c he said he promised his mom he wouldn’t fight without his dad, but then he did one more fight then quit. He used that as a reason he wouldn’t fight other top contenders at the time. Who knows
Pistol Pete
Based on the two regular season games, there is absolutely no reason to think VGK would not be able to beat TBL. Obviously that requires winning three rounds to get there, but the point stands.
Galdom
I hope you are right. The idea is if we are fully healthy we are among the best but I fear Tampa. VGK couldn’t even touch the puck for the entire third period. Every single team except Tampa has weaknesses. I don’t know what Tampa’s weakness is.
Their best forward (Kucherov) is better than anything we have. If Eichel comes back strong tgat can level the playing field.
Their best defenceman (Heyman) is better than anything we have.
In spite of what happened Saturday Vasilevskiy is a lot better than Lehner.
I think we can beat Tampa but I wouldn’t bet on it. Lol
Pistol Pete
You’re right. When they turned it on the third period, VGK couldn’t land a shot. I’m not sure it would have to be that way period after period game after game though. Think the first two periods and add scoring.
Daryl
TBL was without Kucherov as well, which makes a huge difference. It will be interesting to see who can beat them when they are healthy
Pistol Pete
Galdom, in reviewing the third period some of the shot differential is attributable to the three TBL PP’s and some to the VGK lack of execution on the multiple odd man rushes. The point is, addressable issues. Agreed on Vasilevskiy, in fact one could argue he was the difference maker in both games. Yup, elite goaltending helps a lot.
Pistol Pete
And frankly that second TBL goal was scored by VGK. The result of pressure in front of the net but scored by VGK sticks. Up to that point we able defend the period with zero shots.
Daryl
I agree…. TBL IMO is better than any other team. As I said before, VGK can beat any team once, I just don’t know if they can beat any team in a series. I don’t what team will be able to beat TBL in a full series. It will be interesting.
For my Pens, there biggest weakness is their goalie. Jarry reminds me a lot of RL. He can play great and he has to play great for the Pens to beat the best teams, he just can’t play great for long periods of time
Galdom
Terrible spelling. Sorry. Victor Hedman
Pistol Pete
Howden is doing excellent as a Knight and just 23. His points production is significantly higher than pre-VGK and nearly equal to Roy this season who appears to have found the next level at 24.
Howard
I’ll make this take easy. When you think Lehner, think Pekka Rinne. Pekka at times could be great in the net, but what ultimately did him in was allowing TOO MANY SOFT GOALS. So, here’s the deal – VGK backup makes the saves he should make, but does not make the saves Lehner can. On the flip side, Lehner makes some really impressive saves but does not stop the shots he should on a consistent basis. He is almost AN IDENTICAL tender to Pekka Rinne. I don’t think VGK can win The Cup with RL in there.
This writer is also wrong suggesting RL played at a top level in the 2020 bubble. RL also did his best Pekka impersonation and let in just enough soft goal to make the difference in that series.
Galdom
Pekka Rinne had a very good career. One Vezina trophy and four top three Vezina finishes. 19th all time in wins (369) Career .917 save percentage.
Pistol Pete
Galdom, to address your points about how good TBL is, I am less concerned about Kucherov and Hedman being better than their VGK counterparts–that may more or less be the case–but it’s Vasilevskiy that’s the difference maker. One could argue VGK wins both games without him in net. I still say they remain beatable in a series, particularly if Eichel shows up and of course if they are able to stick to their defensive structure.