Iole: It’s Not Just Playoffs Off The Line Now

Meanwhile this year Lehner has had the same save percentage as Subban year one.

On top of that, every year Fleury was with Vegas, they went to the playoffs without question or this anxiety we see now, white-knuckling it every game. His handling of Minnesota and Colorado last year were magnificent.

I hope Foley cleans house and fast. Even if by the grace of God they get to the playoffs this year, it will be a heckuva struggle there.

Not a chance in ice hell!

Keep defending the FO

Bring Manny up. This team would respond well. Fire PDB now.

@ David, correct; however the posters on this site are99% whiners and haters.

They know it. Spoiled rotten scroundrels.
They think hockey is a medieval knight
skating in pre game antics. They can’t even cheer correctly because
all they do is stuff their fact with $20 nachos all game long.

go krak

Ha ha

Buhvuh,

Please explain how the NHL making the expansion rules incredibly favourable, worked out for Seattle?

Pete, I don’t see the benefit of reliving the past. That was 4 years ago and an almost completely different team.

There are positives, although reading some of the posts one might believe they’re in the cellar and not still competing for a playoff spot. I don’t think you can judge Eichel even at 30 games, given the line mates he’s had, the new team he’s learning how to play with, the surgery, and a year not playing. And Dadonov, roundly criticized in this forum, has found his form although it took most of the season and multiple lineups to finally get him there, You can’t honestly judge the team with any confidence because they simply haven’t played 50 or 60 games of a season together.

That said, I always held the position that it wasn’t critical for them to win this year. The timeframe estimated for Eichel to be able to play ranged widely and included the possibility he might not be able to play at all during the season. And although they do have a few players in their mid-30s those players for the most part only have 1-2 years remaining on their contract. The core players are signed for the most part so there can be stability in the roster (if the FO will allow it).

I think they probably have about 3 years remaining in their current window, and that can be extended by future UFA adds or trades to replace expiring contracts. It’s what they have to do, since they didn’t go through the normal process of having a lottery team and drafting truly elite prospects with top 5 picks.

PP
and Covid, people keep forgetting about COVID

and the silly NHL COVID protocol, as well as the Canadian government handling of it. Which favored the , well, Canadian NHL teams to no end.

Pete, I don’t know what Foley will do. He’s in his late 70’s and has other projects (like HSK and VKH). A change in the FO would be a major decision that would involve a lot of time & attention. I do think he sounds as though he is more comfortable now with making decisions relative to the team.

Given what he has said in interviews that comfort levelseems more recent. He said last summer that he finally agreed with GMKM that Fleury had to be traded. That would indicate that GMKM drove the trade decision for Lehner and had been trying to persuade him for at least a season prior that Fleury needed to go. It seems he also trusted GMKM in their firing of Gallant.

I don’t have a strong opinion either way whether GMKM or just KM should be replaced. I do wonder though whether KM’s mindset in player relations & transactions was shaped by his experience in managing and owning the Brandon team. My understanding of juniors is that those mgmt decisions are more autocratic and, given the age & development aspects of youth sports, are less personal and don’t have the long term consequences that NHL player decisions do. I think some of his decisions reflect that. One example is his statement that they never advise the player he’s being traded before it’s final – his reason for not letting Fleury know he was traded to CHI. That wasn’t appropriate given who Fleury is as a future HOFer, his commitment to the team & community, and what he meant to the fan base.

I have always supported the FO, but here are some of the things that have concerned me to the point it is now an issue:

1) The firing of Gallant and hiring of DeBoer.

2) Pursuing Petro and then trading both Schmidt and Stastny to get cap compliant. Schmidt carried the most difficult defensive assignments while Shea was sheltered. Plus he was a glue player in the room. Stastny was a solid 2C and highly intelligent playmaker. He was also a mentor to the younger forwards. And his ability to slow the game down made him invaluable to the team’s offense, especially in zone.

3) The acquisition of Lehner to replace Fleury, and the whole Fleury trade debacle. This also lost them Dave Prior. Foley said that he left the team due to a health issue, but confirmed reports say he was not consulted before the Lehner trade and that led to his firing. It was also the root of DeBoer’s toxic relationship with Fleury all last season, when he never spoke to Fleury the entire season pregame. Add to that McKenna’s comment that PDB will throw goalies under the bus when it suits him, which has led to the current fiasco on RL’s status. This also seems to have negatively impacted the team’s morale which is reflected to some extent in their play.

4) The Dadonov debacle.

5) The current RL controversy unraveling real time in front of the whole league.

6) The lack of honesty and unnecessary concealment of facts that have increasingly characterized the way the coach and FO communicate publicly and to the fan base.

Pile all these up and I have come to the conclusion that something needs to change. As I said before, it may be that Foley demanded that GMKM go get Petro and Eichel, and himself is the reason for the erratic way the team has made trades and acquisitions. But given everything I’ve read and heard my sense is that Foley trusted the judgment of GMKM and gave them the free hand to make those decisions.

I do also think that the team is at a point where either Lehner or PDB (et al) need to go. It is toxic and now playing out in public, basically because PDB put it out there.

So, although ThG scoffs at my ‘knee jerk’ reaction saying they are the “laughing stock of the league”, it is not a knee jerk reaction. And all you have to do is follow the ‘mob media’ (as ThG calls it) that actually consists of knowledgeable people with direct info sources across the NHL (players, coaches, GMs, owners, league mgmt). It is obvious as the nose on your face that the general view of VGK management is basically “WTF??” at this point. It’s also the general view of the local hockey media in Vegas, other than VGK-run media which is loathe to levy any criticism of the organization, for obvious reasons.

I’m a fan obviously and have always supported the team regardless of any personal reservations I may have had about trades and decisions that have been made. I will continue to be hopeful and optimistic that VGK can bring home the Cup one day in the not too distant future. I don’t sympathize with the many dire predictions often found here, but there are definitely issues of concern.

Well, at least – from my perspective – we can all now move on in agreement from The Walrus as our future netminder. Just reminding everyone – that this is what I had predicted in the off season.

Discussions on the future begin after the season is over.

Some people have thought THE hockey GOD is RL and certainly that can’t be true. However, I do think it’s an outside chance that this guy is Kelly McMoron.

If that’s the case – Kelly can only blame himself for signing RL when no other team in NHL would take him. Those other teams knew the problem RL was and is.

The biggest issue in VGK is Kelly Mccriminal – He’s an amatuer former JR. League coach, and knows nothing how to build a winning team, and has an ego the size of Mt. Everest.

Pete, I don’t subscribe to the narrative that ‘no one else would sign him’ and Vegas made a mistake doing so.

He got his personal life together when he went to NYI, and had a Vezina finalist year. At the time he and Greiss were sharing the net. No one ever mentions that Greiss didn’t get a long term contract either, and he was traded the next year as well. The Isles had Sorokin in the wings and there was no point in signing ANY goalie long term. So that ‘example’ doesn’t apply.

Lehner signed with CHI on a short term contract with Corey Crawford having been trying to come back from injury for a year or more. No one knew for sure if CC would return so a short term contract to a good goalie like Lehner made sense. It turns out that Crawford did make it back so there was no need for a LT deal with another goalie. As a result the Hawks traded Lehner for Subban (who is a marginal #2). Turns out Crawford didn’t end up staying at Chicago, which is why they have a need now for a #1 goalie. It’s not important though since they’re in a full rebuild and have a projected starter in development that should be ready in a year or two.

Vegas had a verbal agreement for a 5 yr deal in place with Lehner as of March 2020, so there would have been no other contract discussions possible with other teams. The goalie market was relatively stable during those years prior to Covid and did not really open up until this last postseason when it became a goalie carousel.

Bottom line is that I can see why Vegas got RL, as Subban wasn’t good enough to back up in the upcoming playoffs. And they believed they had a legit shot to win it all. I think what happened once RL started playing (and did well) may have changed the situation. And the FO saw him as a viable replacement to Fleury as he finished out his contract.

From Wikipedia:

Hard to believe McPhee does not have the brain power to recognize and evaluate that Lehner up to that point had never been signed long term. Obviously he and others in the organization did their DD. As I have pointed out his stats as a rental over 3 regular season and 16 playoff games were excellent which dovetailed with the excellent Vezina runner up season with the NYI the previous system. Fleury did struggle in his first VGK contract season so at the time it was a good fit. So far though it’s been a struggle.

“McPhee interned on Wall Street in New York for two off-seasons while playing for the Rangers in the 1980s. After retirement from his professional playing career, he studied law at Rutgers University’s law school in New Jersey and clerked for a judge on the United States Court of International Trade before moving into a hockey management career.[9]”

THG,

Well said one of your best post!